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ROME, Italy – In March, BNP Paribas Open tournament director Raymond Moore stepped down after making controversial statements about the merits of equal prize money at the tour’s combined events. A few days later, WTA founder Billie Jean King and Chris Evert held an impromptu press conference at the Miami Open, which delved deep into the history of the fight for equal prize money at the Slams. At the Mutua Madrid Open, tournament owner Ion Tiriac expressed his concerns over whether equal prize money was a sustainable business model for combined events.

The debate over equal prize money, which was achieved at all four Slams nearly a decade ago, simply has not gone gone away.

With that in mind, WTA CEO Steve Simon joined the Insider Podcast to weigh in on the current debate. A full transcript of the discussion is below. You can also listen to our talk on this week’s podcast.

WTA Insider: To start the discussion, does it surprise you that equal prize money has become this topic that still is debated and discussed at length pretty consistently?

Simon: Yes. Tennis, overall, has done a terrific job of addressing equal prize money. With the leadership of the Grand Slams and the main mandatory-combined events, which have led the way, I think tennis has addressed it very well. You can always do more, of course, but it has been addressed, and they deserve a lot of credit for the leadership shown in doing it. I think we’re farther ahead than many people when they get into the areas of compensation and equality and those types of things.

That being said, the fact that the conversation comes up is disappointing, to say the least. It’s a conversation that’s been done; the agreements are in place for it, and I think we should be embracing it as opposed to talking about it. I don’t think we need to be talking about it; we need to be talking about how we can do it more, and expanding it across all of our events and things like that, which we still have work to do in that space.

The comments that came out of Madrid were certainly disappointing, because Madrid was one of the leaders in this process, and signed up and agreed as a Mandatory event sanction to support equal prize money – and they have. We fully expect them to continue showing that leadership, and supporting it going forward. But obviously, there’s issues still to address.

WTA Insider: It comes at a time when two of the three Premier Mandatories have gone on, Indian Wells, Madrid and Miami, where you have tournament leaders coming out and saying that there is a frustration with respect to the agreement to pay equal prize money. My understanding of that is that it is being driven by almost an arms race between the sport’s biggest tournaments, whether it’s the Slams or the Mandatories and the ATP Masters. From your perspective – now you’re with the WTA, but you’ve spent the time on the tournament side – where is this coming from? Where is the frustration from the tournament side, and why do you think that it keeps getting aired out?

Simon: Well, I think that it’s percolated on two fronts. One is that the two tours, ATP and WTA, have different operating structures, and different economic bases that they work from. We deal with our members in different ways.

The factual [basis] is that the TV revenues, broadcast revenues from the ATP side, are higher than what we receive from the WTA side right now. The WTA has signed a new broadcast agreement that starts in 2017 that closes the gap dramatically, but still there’s a lot of work to be done. That’s something we need to address and continue working on, because those are economics and they do make a difference, and this is business.

But the issue of equal goes way beyond one element of broadcast agreements. The WTA and the ATP at these combined events are both contributing to that brand and that product, and is being promoted as that brand and that product. So, equal goes way beyond one element (television revenue) which is being pointed out. I think it’s a function of, one, the issues associated with different financial models, which are coming from the two tours, and I think that the recent increases in prize money – which were exorbitant – that the ATP recently put into place, has exacerbated the entire situation and has raised angst, because obviously a very high prize money increase will be multiplied by two. We certainly respect it, but we still need to show the leadership and protect equality. We won’t go anywhere but there.

WTA Insider: In the United States this is a discussion that extends outside of tennis. It’s a big talking point within US Soccer as the women are trying to renegotiate their pay scale, and one of the big questions that keeps coming up is about the free market. Revenues should always dictate back-end compensation, it’s been argued. I’ll pose that to you: how important is revenue on the back end, and should it be a 1:1?

Simon: As I said before, this is business and revenues are like oxygen, which allow you to breathe in business. So they’re very important, and equality isn’t an entitlement. It needs to be earned, and you need to do your job and invest into it.

As I said earlier, we’re having a tendency to pick just one element of the equation, and if you think about it, the Mutua Madrid Open, as an example, is promoted as a combined WTA/ATP event. They are driving all of the values that they’re realizing through that event, ticket sales, hospitality sales, all of the different things. The only things that’s different is broadcasting because those are two separate agreements that have completely different compositions – so they’re not equal.

You have to look at the whole package in totality, and when you have both the WTA and ATP contributing in the same manner to that final product, and the draws are the same, they’re playing the same, they should be compensated in the same way. You can’t just pick on one element, so it’s not a true 1:1 because there are many more elements to play into that.

WTA Insider: Rome is a Premier 5 tournament, not a Mandatory tournament. On the men’s side, it’s a Masters event. You see a similar situation in Cincinnati and Canada, as well. A New York Times article came out a few weeks ago arguing that these events should also be equal prize money, which they’re not, because they’re currently of different sanctions. I’m curious as to what your response is to that, and whether the way the WTA’s Premier structure is, with three different levels, does that create some level of confusion as to the levels of these events?

Simon: I have a couple of comments on that. First, you’re absolutely right that they are different levels, and we have different tier levels at the same event. And when I said we have work to do, this is some of the work we have to do because we have those events and the minimum prize money for each of those are different, and you can’t just ask them to all of a sudden jump up a category because that’s not what they signed up for. So we have some work to do to try to get that closer together.

I can say that we have some of those events in that category that have actually indicated an interest in trying to get to equal prize money. So there’s great leadership being shown there and I think it’s the right thing to do because again, they’re seeing both the men’s and women’s product contributing to that tournament’s brand and all of the ticket and sponsorship sales – everything that they do is because it’s a combined event. It’s really just a couple of elements that we need to improve upon.

We also have events where the WTA pays more than the men, like Beijing, where we have the higher tier event and they have a lower tier event. You have those in our game right now because we’re two separate tours with separate structures.

I think long term, we have work to do, and hopefully – I’m not saying whether it can or can’t be done – but I’m certainly one for working with everyone, versus just working on our side. Is there a way that we can work closer with the ATP and get closer in the alignment of our sanction levels, so that you can get to that naturally. I think it’s something that’s a little bit of a work in progress.

WTA Insider: I talked to a few players in Indian Wells, and they said equal prize money is an issue but for us the thing that affects our bottom line is the distribution of prize money from No.1 to 100, and making sure that a player ranked No.80-90-125 can make a living as a professional tennis player. You mentioned that that’s something you wanted to look at. Could you expand on why that’s important and how that’s possible to adjust?

Simon: The distribution of prize money is an on-going debate and discussion that’s been going on for years and will continue to. It’s the natural debate versus the value that should be received from winning a tournament versus getting into the tournament and not having the same success as the player who gets to the end of the tournament. Where should that value and most of the prize money go, especially when you’re playing 1-2 days and someone else is playing 5-6?

There’s clearly a natural progression where the end should get more than then beginning, but how much more and how should that be spread out? The overarching question is how do we continue to raise the compensation level, which means raising our business, so that at some of our lower tier events the prize money levels can get up higher and get to a level that makes things more sustainable for that player ranked No.30-100, which is where the challenges come from.

We need to do that, we need to figure out how can we get to where our players won’t be dependent on the four Slams to make their profit, and that they can make their living, earn their points, as a WTA player. The Grand Slams should be where they play for history, and all of the great things that come from making it into the Grand Slams and performing well. That’s something philosophically we have to work on, and it is something we’re working on with our structure right now, in discussions. It’s not something we’re sitting around waiting to discuss; we’re discussing it very heavily, and I think it’s a very important topic for us.

WTA Insider: How important is messaging to the players on that angle? One of the trends I’ve noticed over the last 5-6 years is that the more you talk to players, the more they talk about the Slams. WTA and ATP events are lead-ups to the big events. While I can understand the logic, the players don’t necessarily emphasize the importance of tour level events. How important is it to touch base with them and talk about the tour?

Simon: I think it’s very important. Since I’ve started, we’ve already had three different sessions, which were open for players to come and visit, and talk about many issues and talk about the vision and where I want to take it and the improvements we have to do. It’s very critical and it’s through that communication that the players will begin to feel that their opinions and voices are being heard. It doesn’t mean that they’ll always get what they want, but it’s important that they’re providing their feedback and know that the feedback is being listened to and respected, and not just discounted.

As we continue that process, and as they see their voice being heard as we’re making balanced decisions, and we begin to make the improvements that we’re making, they begin seeing more of the importance and they have a little more skin in this thing called the WTA Tour, which is what we want them to have. They are part-owners of this tour; they own 50% of it, so it’s very important that they feel that sense of ownership and that sense of pride, that this is their business.

The Grand Slams are history. They are the pillars of our game, and they always will be. We support that and will always recognize that, but that only happens eight weeks a year. We have 35 weeks that are ours, and so we need to get that sense of ownership and pride in building our business, our tour to a level that they’re all proud to be part of.

WTA Insider: Back to the topic of raising the compensation levels on the lower levels: in terms of executing on that, what are the biggest roadblocks there?

Simon: We have to create a business model down in that area that makes sense for the people operating at that level because they don’t get the player field that you see in Rome, and that has a whole different dynamic and a different business model that will follow that. I think we have to look at that business model, and from a tour perspective, as we evolve, how can we begin to better subsidize those events and support them to make them financially viable for the promoters and athletes?

That might just be a function of restructuring how we operate as a tour financially, so we can figure out how we flow the monies that are coming through the central organization back to the members to support these events in different ways and different subsidies. But I think that’s something that we have to look at that would allow us to grow those events and build them, and build the economic platform, which I’m not sure – it’s a very difficult one for them to be successful down there right now.

WTA Insider: You’re talking about International; Premiers are ok?

Simon: They’re ok; like any other business, you have good ones, and ones that struggle a little bit more. But overall, they’re in a much better place because they have a much deeper product to deliver.

WTA Insider: Right. The field is stronger.

Simon: The Internationals, you may have a few of them seeing a Top 10 player; most of them don’t ever see a Top 10 player, and they’re seeing players from No.11 on. Obviously local players are very important, but it’s a challenging business model and something we have to focus on.

WTA Insider: We’re a couple of weeks out from the French Open. What’s been your overall view of the clay seasons thus far?

Simon: It’s obviously going to be a very exciting event at Roland Garros in Paris. I think we have a healthy group of players, which I know is something we haven’t been saying very much here lately. But I do think that the players are overall pretty healthy going into Paris, which is good.

What I’m seeing is that I’m excited for the future, because I’m seeing a lot of really young players beginning to step up. What we’ve seen this year is a lot of young players stepping up and beginning to defeat our seeds in the tournaments, or the “favorites.” It’s been happening repeatedly, so to me that reflects the new transition, and new talent is coming in and really beginning to challenge our premier players.

I think that’s very positive and very exciting. When that starts happening on these big stages, that’s when we begin developing new stars and people to follow. I’m very excited about it and think it’s going to be a very compelling Roland Garros.

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STRASBOURG, France – Caroline Garcia completed her French Open preparations in style on Saturday, outplaying qualifier Mirjana Lucic-Baroni in the final of the Internationaux de Strasbourg.

Watch live action from Strasbourg this week on WTA Live powered by TennisTV!

Twenty-four hours on from her marathon victory over Virginie Razzano, Garcia looked fresh as a daisy, the nerves so often accompanying French players on home soil conspicuous by their absence.

In her opening service game she was taken to deuce, fending of the threat courtesy of a couple of well-placed serves. Any lingering anxieties were completely removed the next game, a blistering forehand return winner helping her to the break. As the winners continued to flow, and Lucic-Baroni searched in vain for the form that had accounted for Kristina Mladenovic the previous round, Garcia quickly stretched this lead to 5-1.

With the set seemingly a lost cause, Lucic-Baroni’s game belatedly clicked into gear as she reduced her arrears to 5-4. However, Garcia recomposed herself to close out the set before dominating the second to wrap up a 6-4, 6-1 victory.

“I felt very confident going into the final. The first set I let her back into it. The first set is super important in tennis for momentum. Because you want to get off to a good start. And I got that today, which helped for the rest of the match,” Garcia said.

For Lucic-Baroni, who lost at the same stage of the tournament 19 years ago, it was a match too far: “It was my seventh match. I was a bit slow. A bit tired. It was to be expected. I’m proud to get to the final though.

“People have been asking me to sign pictures from 1999 – it’s like another life. But it makes me proud to have been able to come back and be at the same stage 19 years later.”

Garcia’s victory extends her perfect record with Lucic-Baroni, against whom she has now dropped just one set in four career meetings: “I have a good record against Lucic-Baroni and the match today was a lot more difficult than it looked. She joked in the presentation about beating me soon – she’s a great player and someone I look up to.”

Next stop for Garcia, whose only previous WTA title came two years ago in Bogotá, is Paris for her home major, Roland Garros, where she hopes to once again harness the energy of her compatriots.

“Another title is great – it’s progress but every tournament is a new chance to develop,” she added. “But today is a great day for me, especially in front of home fans here in France.”

In the doubles final, top seeds Anabel Medina Garrigues and Arantxa Parra Santonja proved far too strong for María Irigoyen and Liang Chen, running out 6-2, 6-0 winners to lift a fourth title together and boost their Olympic qualification hopes.

The result was of particular significance to former singles champion Medina Garrigues, who is contemplating retiring at the end of the year: “All the victories are special. But this is important. With Roland Garros next week and we need points for Rio also, so it’s 280 points.

“Having won three times in singles it’s special for me here. It might be my last year playing tennis so coming back to Strasbourg was special. At the moment I’m 50-50 whether I will carry on next year. I will see how I feel physically and decide.”

.@CaroGarcia can't believe it! ? ? ? pic.twitter.com/SWLdmdYpFB

— WTA (@WTA) 21 May 2016

PARIS, France – No.26 seed Kristina Mladenovic has saved some of her best tennis for her home major tournament, and this year’s Roland Garros appears to be no different; the French No.1 eased past former doubles partner Timea Babos, 6-4, 6-3 to book a third round clash with 21-time Grand Slam champion Serena Williams.

Mladenovic and Babos spent the last few years as one of the tour’s top doubles teams, reaching the 2014 Wimbledon final and qualifying for the BNP Paribas WTA Finals Singapore presented by SC Global, but the former began 2016 with countrywoman Caroline Garcia in preparation for the Rio Olympics, while the latter has paired with fellow big hitter Yaroslava Shvedova.

“It was extremely difficult to prepare this match,” she said in her post match press conference. “And she is a girl I know by heart. She’s one of my best friends. We have known each other since we were really kids.

“When you know your opponent by heart usually this is not good, because there’s pressure, there’s tension. You anticipate her shots, you try and change your game to surprise her.

“But it’s also the attitude, the general atmosphere. You don’t exactly know what to expect and what to do.”

French hopeful Mladenovic sets up 3R meeting with defending champion Serena w/straight sets win over Babos. #RG16 pic.twitter.com/0doXa0xw6Z

— Roland Garros (@rolandgarros) May 26, 2016

Mladenovic and Garcia have come into the doubles event as favorites to end Martina Hingis and Sania Mirza’s bid at the Santina Slam, while Babos is in the midst of a career-best season, upsetting Venus Williams in the Internazionali BNL d’Italia after starting the clay court season with a run to the semifinals in Rabat.

The match appeared straightforward from the start for Mladenovic, who raced out to a quick 3-0 lead, but lost the next four games despite holding points for 4-1. That proved to be the final twist in Court Philippe Chatrier’s last match of the day, as the 23-year-old won the last three games on the bounce to clinch the opening set, and just one service break decided the second for her to win the match in 79 minutes.

“I tried to work a lot on statistics with my coach. This is what we did. We looked at her past seven or eight matches on clay in the recent weeks, or, for instance — well, we looked at her stats. That’s to help me in what I was going to do.

“But look at her stats, today she did totally the contrary of what you have in the data.

“This is the beauty of our sport. It’s also why this match was difficult. I was ready.”

In what could be a rivalry for the future, the two exchanged powerful groundstrokes from the back of the court, with Mladenovic hitting 22 winners to Babos’ 13, but it was the 22 erros from the big-serving Hungarian that proved disastrous; Mladenovic managed to reign in her error count to 18.

Serena Williams stands between the Frenchwoman and the second week of Roland Garros; the two have never met before, but the three-time champion will could well face stiff opposition from the inspired youngster and the enthusiatic French crowd.

“The first word I would use is ‘at last,’ because, well, what can I say? It’s going to be difficult. Maybe I wanted to have a better draw, but then also I think it’s very positive.

“I have to take it very positively. This is an experience, something to do, it’s a dream. I grew up watching Serena play. Then I’m going to play against her.

“So she is the best, I think, in my sport. She’s a legend. I’m extremely happy, because this is a challenge.

“She is dominating. She’s been dominating every single match in the recent years. And it’s going to be very complicated. And as we speak, frankly, I’m very happy so far. I enjoy what I have done. I know how difficult it was for me at the beginning of the tournament, so what I will do is – of course I will debrief my matches. I will enjoy these two wins, and then I will try and get ready as best I can for this match against Serena.”

Earlier in the day, Virginie Razzano wasn’t able to match Mladenovic and Alizé Cornet’s wins against No.29 seed Daria Kasatkina, falling, 3-6, 6-1, 6-3, but Pauline Parmentier backed up her run to the quarterfinals of the Internationaux de Strasbourg with a 6-3, 6-1 win over Irina Falconi. No.15 seed and Rome finalist Madison Keys continued her clay court renaissance, defeating Mariana Duque-Mariño, 6-3, 6-2 to book a third round encounter with either Julia Goerges or Monica Puig.

Karin Knapp followed up her upset win over No.5 seed Victoria Azarenka by beating Anastasija Sevastova, 6-3, 6-4, and will play Yulia Putintseva, who pulled off an upset of her own over No.28 seed and 2014 semifinalist Andrea Petkovic, 6-2, 6-2.

Dominika Cibulkova and Carla Suárez Navarro booked the most high-profile clash as the Mutua Madrid Open runner-up recovered from a second set hiccup to shut out Ana Konjuh, 6-4, 3-6, 6-0, while Suárez Navarro was emphatic in her 6-1, 6-3 victory over Wang Qiang. 

La joie de @kikimladenovic après sa victoire contre timea babos ! elle est au 3ème tour ?? #RG16 https://t.co/xvYycG6O2G

— Roland Garros (@rolandgarros) May 26, 2016